loft bombing

Discussion in 'Warbirds International' started by mumble, Jul 23, 2010.

  1. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    This most likely never happened in the actual war, but does anyone think that loft (toss) bombing would be effective in FH? I'm developing a system for doing such a thing, and so far I'm having some success hitting statics in offline practice. I still need to work a few kinks out of the system, though. Of chief concern is the issue of range to the target when it comes to static targets. That's just a matter of getting everything matched with it's sight picture. To help with this, I will remind everyone that some ground target with the width or other measure about a fighter's wingspan across fits just inside the default gunsight at 300 yards. Guesstimate from there your range to target. Jeeps, which is what this is being designed for, have no such ranging problem. :mafia:

    The most difficult part about the loft delivery is that a lot of planning must go into it. I'm working on a calculator to help with this, so half of the problem might be solved. The other difficult part is that some precise flying needs to happen. In order to use this technique, one must be able to fly to a pre-designated pitch angle, altitude, and airspeed, with the target being at a certain distance away, and do so very smoothly.

    To give an example of the routine that works best for me, I generally line up the crosshair just long of the target. This does two things. One, since I'm already at very low altitude, it helps keep you from flying into the ground, and two, keeps the crosshair referenced close enough to the target to guess your range. Once at the range I calculated earlier, I initiate my pop-up to my release altitude and try to hit my airspeed at that altitude. Once at that point, I release my ordnance and roll away from target into a wing over to slice away from the acks (if I do it right, they never fire a shot). On a personal note, I generally have missed short so far, so if I am in an airframe that can carry more that one bomb, I pickle at release altitude for the first bomb, and every bomb after that I tend to release for every 100' above release altitude for as long as I can maintain pre-planned airspeed. Anything after 500' above release altitude is time to safe and make a second pass, and I have not yet released at anything greater than 300' above release altitude.

    So far, the pre-planned information I've been flying on is a release altitude of 1000' AGL, at airspeed of 200 MPH IAS, with a pitch angle of +30 degrees, which produces a range slightly more than d10. I try to keep my release parameters within +/-100' AGL, +/- 20 MPH IAS, and +/-5 degrees pitch angle.

    So, jeep drivers, stay as close to the static targets as you possibly can. :D
     
  2. looseleaf

    looseleaf Well-Known Member

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    Brother Mumble;

    Holy Barnes Wallis!!!!!

    Please post some tracks of your bomb runs.

    Thanks!

    RTC-TTC !!!

    :super:
     
  3. -exec-

    -exec- FH Consultant

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    never tried to experiment because could not imagine how to fix inclination, speed and altitude, not mentioning distance and excess
     
  4. looseleaf

    looseleaf Well-Known Member

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    Definitely an art form !

    :D
     
  5. looseleaf

    looseleaf Well-Known Member

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    Definitely an art form !


    "The Force, Luke. Let the Force guide you..."


    :D
     
  6. Cabron

    Cabron Well-Known Member

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    It didn't happen in WW2 but my dad practiced lofting for nuke delivery.
     
  7. looseleaf

    looseleaf Well-Known Member

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    Hahaha... Horseshoes and hand grenades and....."


    American NATO commander back in the 60's while speaking to fellow European military commanders was quoted:

    "The problem with Europe is that the cities are less that a megaton apart.."

    :eek:
     
  8. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    That looks about right for pitch up, altitude and speed readout on the panel, and distance reference is a little tricky. To give you a gauge to look at for pitch angle, the horizon almost disappears from the attitude indicator for 30 deg nose up/down. So far the hardest part is getting the ranging information correct on static targets. Because of that, it is not a very accurate method of delivery, but it seems to be a safer method of delivery. So far I've managed accuracy +/- 200 ft. when/if I do get hits on the target.

    Now for the "science" part.

    Fill in the blanks for the distance travelled function for theta, the funny looking O with a - in the middle (pitch at release), Y0 (altitude above target AGL), and v (airspeed in FPS/MPS as applicable).

    g = 9.8 m/s or 32.??? f/s

    To get icon range, d/300 if you're using imperial units, d/100 for metric to translate output to icon ranges.

    @LL
    Will post some tracks after I make a few runs in live arena(going to be a month or so until I can play in arena :( ). Offline practice is no substitute for the real thing. :znaika:
     
  9. looseleaf

    looseleaf Well-Known Member

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    9.80665 m/s/s or 32.1740ft/s/s


    RTC-TTC


    :D


    Hummm .... what planes here use dive brakes/speed brakes?
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2010
  10. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    P-38L, SBD, D3A, Ju-87 (except G), Ju-88 (except S-1), I thought Me-410 has one, and that's about all I can think of for what has speed brakes/spoilers/other drag devices.
     
  11. tazman88

    tazman88 Well-Known Member

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    This could be very useful for quick raids!
     
  12. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    Attached should be a gunsight file. Remove the .txt and place in your warbirds folder. The gunsight should look like the normal default cross with a pair of little verticle lines in the center. This should be your cue to start the loft maneuver, mentioned earlier in this thread, on targets that are approximately as wide as a fighter wingspan (e.g. the wide side of fuel tanks and radar :)). You may want to let the radar dish bleed over the sides of the box a little bit, as the dish seems to appear slightly smaller than a wingspan.

    If the gunsight doesn't draw itself properly, let me know so I can make corrections to it.

    NOTE: If you are using the 640x resolution, change the 3 to 1.

    If any would like to start making a few attempts with this method, please let us know what luck. :cheers:

    EDIT: Does anyone know how to record a track offline so I can get that task completed? I have a feeling that this requires a clip or two for showing how to do this thing and I would like to hurry up and post tracks. :shuffle:
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Aug 5, 2010
  13. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    EDIT: When I find the TA up or I get MA to myself I'll try to get a track up.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2010
  14. mumble

    mumble Well-Known Member

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    For your enjoyment, here's a training run of the loft bomb. :@popcorn:
     

    Attached Files: