Tone down the ottos!!!!!!!!!

Well, think I'm finished here. Pretty bad when basically only lazer guided computer assist ottos in Li that just took off can ping the shit out of you didn't even no the guy was there just shot heggins in a a6m. So until FH gets this fixed, I'm done so this can basically be easy mode flight now for all newbies or lazer guided otto assist buff/Li game. En-fucking-joy

Really thought, things were in the right direction here. But...... have fun dweebs!

 

I think that if we got rid of the uber otto, nobody would ever fly bombers. Few people fly a bomber as it is. Nobody goes and flies cover for the bombers, and if they do, they chase one con and maybe kill it, then go to try and vulch at a field with all the ack up that the buff hasn't gotten to yet. Jackass, amen. Also, the Li-2/Ju-52 pilots are usually hosed since even fewer pilots ever want to make low level sweeps. So, until pilots get more organized, or we start teaching pilots here to work as a team, I think otto will always be a 50/50 of either amazingly immaculate, or utterly useless. Unless you're interested in nothing but fighters vs. fighters.

 

The computer guided ottos in the game are VERY affective, especially when they start shooting from D7. Gunners on any aircraft should should only be as affective as a human operator. Attacking Li2's or Buffs take quite a different approach than attacking an un-gunned fighter. I've had quite good success taking down buffs/li2s by being more cautious. I learned some VERY VERY important lessons recently after watching these videos below here. I learned the Thatch weave many many years ago, when I could have a wingman at any given moment. These videos by Thatch below are for how to attack gunned aircraft when paired up with a wingman. How to do it, and how NOT to do it. I've done it the wrong way many times!

Watch these videos, all of em! Learned some good stuff from these!


USN WW2 Training Film: Thatch Demo Part 1 of 3
USN WW2 Training Film: Thatch Demo Part 2 of 3
USN WW2 Training Film: Thatch Demo Part 3 of 3

 

Don't be a putz alw, I wasn't even attacking the Li and it's lazer guided bullshit ottos zinged theshit out of me, It's totally stupid. and some even do insane manuevers to get the ottos guns on you. I don't think in real life a human being could ever get the gunsite on anything whilst a plane is manuevering like that. I realise you want more people to come to this game and I do too, but not with shit like computer assisted ottos! and if it is like this can I suggest heat seeking missles or better yet a death ray!! freakin Arcade Game this has become. Have fun with this BS!

 

I hope you don't mean what I think by calling me a "putz".

"Come on lets Dogfight, win or lose lets have some fun <S> bullet "

I take your signature as stating..."It's just a game, let's shoot it out and have some fun!"




Well, be glad gunners don't work unless airborn. I'll strike it up as bad luck in your case. Not any worse than being right over that field on deck when some ack or jeepack 1 ping sends you to the tower. I really avoid flying on deck at an open enemy field for these reasons alone. No sympathy here, sorry.

I've flown Li2's like during last campaign where it performed quite well as a fighter, my ottos shooting down several attackers, and in some ways, performing better than some fighters. I've had situations where I overshot and didn't get one hit on a buff/transport just to be blown out of the sky by ottos. It's been a while since I have flown over a gunned transport, and not noticing it there but, being within striking range and getting PK'd in the process. The PK thing is one thing that really bothers me. It happens too often, too easily from wrong angles.

 

Honestly, I play the game less than I otherwise would due to a relative lack of fighter pilots. I think a big part of the lack of fighter pilots is otto. Especially early war, when lethality of everything is so low.

Personally, I think otto should never outshine a human gunner. I think any reasonable player will look at what otto is capable of and say that it often surpasses what a human gunner can accomplish.

All otto params should be locked. Range should be very short. Accuracy should be very low. This will retain the ability for otto to call out incoming bandits and kill those that fly up a buffs 6oc without evasive.

 

New otto settings are ready, need just final approvement and will be implement in test mode in MA.
Ottos will not be much less effective in general.
They will loose ability to shoot precise at maneuvering targets, but if u hang in gunsight with zero angle speed, u die fast, may be even faster than now.
Tests show that such settings make tactics of fast attacks and evasions (several if need) almost safe and worth of use instead hanging at lower 6 in hope just to kill buff faster than it kills you.
I hope u will like it.

 

The main thing that needs to be fixed about otto is its unreal ability to keep its guns trained on a target that passes otto on perpendicular course at a huge lateral speed.

Code:

target makes a pass at high speed

---------------->






                           otto flies this way
                                 |
                                 |
                                 |
                                 |
                                 V

A targeting problem like this should be unsolvable by anything except a modern computer-assisted system, yet in the game I've literally gotten my ass torn off by otto in situations like this one many times.
But reading what you just wrote, here's hoping that this will soon be a thing of the past.

 

Might be cool. I look forward to its implementation.

 

Current otto settings:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4hA8IqSC58

 

Fully agree, that was the main idea of the fix.

 

@alw my putz comment was you made it seem like I don't know what I am doing in this game on how to bring down an Li/ju52 or buff. Yes it takes different tactics for sure and I know this and have had great success in bring them down, so i don't need a lesson on how too. If your intent was for any newbie or someone that doesn't know how to fight and learn from their mistakes, well this wasn't the thread for that. You could have started another one. Your a good fighter and a patent teacher to those that need it, but honestly ya gotta know or take in account on who your talking too. You posted this after I started this thread and you know very well I am not a newbie been at this sim since before there was a FH.

Now on my signiture, it's true, "Lets dog fight and have some fun" but honestly I die more from ottos then anything else these days it seems. I don't hang for the most part down low near acks or jeeps for the most part. I had just killed heggins in a low a6m, now if an ack pops up and blasts me well thats my fault, but an Li, wtf is an li doing ack starring at a burnt out field? I didn't see him take off (he probably wanted to drop his own troops to kill down times because it was in sad shape (the field) So I fly unknowingly over him and that unmistakable rattling of a 12mm gatlin gun does me in. it's just wrong in so many ways. This is what I'm pissed about. Also what others have stated about being ripped to shreds at odd angles while flying at high speed i have had this happen too. and thats another thing that needs to be fixed.

Now seeing that something has been newly implemented for the ottos, lets see whats happens. I don't want the buff drivers to worry, but the way ottos are or hopefully were was just not realistic and fair, and for Li and ju52 drivers, well it's risky buissness flying low in a big lumbering AC always has been and it always should be.

 

If this fix is truely implemented and work well, I'll be the first to say a Big Thank You

 

much ado about nothing (i.e. "ottos")

 

Ackstarring a Li in a base defense role can be pretty darn effective. This TOD, I've been exploring ways I can use the current Li+Otto setup in asymmetrical roles. It can make quite the area denial craft if the intent and execution is there. Sure, a real fighter is more versatile, but a Li being a valid option for air combat, even in fairly narrow roles, is off.

If ottos are nothing, then their stats being changed or removed will change nothing. 0*x=0

 

This has been puzzling me for years; why is it that sometimes otto can't hit the broad side of a barn and other times its accuracy is breathtaking? Is this randomness intended?

 

Oh man, it's always been like that. Back when I flew on iEN WB, it wasn't that noticeable since the otto acc param was set lower. If my memory serves, otto was eventually turned off in the online arenas, so there is that.

The above is based on my memory, which is spotty at best.

Another thing to consider is that most users have better connections than in those days, so perhaps that has something to do with the perceived lethality of otto.

Yet another thing is lethality in game terms. Seems that buffs soak up a ton of damage, while fighters take every ounce of it. That can create enhance the perception of ottos power.

 

I agree here. There are more than a few basic physical properties that are the opposite of what they should be IMHO. I find that flying a bomber slower makes the otto more effective when an attacking fighter is attacking my dead 6. Just so you know, flying the bomber slower increases the velocity of closure for the attacking fighter, which means less time for the gunner to acquire, engage, and hopefully destroy the target. Yet, for some reason flying slower is more effective.

Also, as antred mentioned, orthogonal vectors to the bomber actually get more hits scored on my attacking fighter than flying on a bomber's dead 6 does. I don't understand how that is a valid model at all.

I have also seen these properties displayed in field acks. I can fly through acks at +400 MPH and get hit from every gun on the field, but if I fly through in an I-153 at say 200 MPH, nothing hits me. The only way that I can effectively get through the ADA is with the spiral dive because I'm constantly changing my vector during that maneuver in both azimuth and speed.

Disclaimer:
I haven't put serious thought into the function of otto/field ack in awhile, and will require more time to consider all scenarios once again. However, I have recently experienced the orthogonal vector accuracy of otto and the inaccuracy of otto engaging a fighter flying at my dead 6 with a velocity of closure of 100 MPH or less.

 

+10

 

Btw, new otto released at MA for open test.