very good posts, leda! politia is also about compromise between the groups representing different ideas to reconcile their existince in a single society and thus keep it away from instability. on the other hand I have always questioned the notion of aurea mediocritas. How could the existence of extremities dress in statute their median? Isnt this the mode in which terrorists and their opposing dictators operate? Post-modernity relinquished the moral right of both and I believe all posters in this thread, me and boroda taken aside, are proudly post-modern? May I ask you then, can the establishment of further extremity change what we call moderate? Yes it can but still thats not moral, seems to be right answer. Yes, I see, the goals dont justify all means. Thank you, my question is answered, ha-ha! We live in Galilean political space, I am afraid. it might at moments seem to us there is a distinguished point of origin but this is just an illusion created by perspective of a single history. (Additional histories are available, but today they have been marginalised and so are easily crossed out by the proponents of the victorios history as backwards or just as curious tourist destinations) In this framework should a system that stands in the middle of the historicly established space take pride of that? By doing so it claims that we have achieved the successful end of our evolution! The other societies are only chaotic spin-outs by the accompanying turbulence and now after the process has hit the correct solution they would sooner or later prove unstable and drift towards it. After all, isnt the fall of the Eastern Bloc a demonstration of just this? Hmm, all this smells like revolution to me! The end of history always was followed suit by a new beginning!
Its all Napoleons fault. Brits detested him so much they decided theyll never again keep the same money, measurements and side of the road as the bloody continentals! so, yeah, they had to invent different ones. And the Stout and the Ale as well, and the semi-detached house. Should we speak about churches instead? I might be confused about the best form of government but I will finish by converting you all over to THE Church. The Jehovah`s witnesses knocking on my door last week did walk away with a few tasks to read upon before they try to come back and preach to me, lol.
Please don't consider me to be a post-modernist After several drinks I will begin to expound, to anyone within listening distance, upon the evils of relativism. I frown upon cynical, sophisicated "bla bla" speech or belief that has no fixed origin or goal. "Hier stehe ich, ich kann nicht anders!" (Yeah, I'm Lutheran, by birth not practice
I would love to hear that conversation! Last time they approached my door, I told them: "I'm a little drunk and not prepared to talk about religion at the moment. Do you believe in transmigration of the soul? Leave me alone!" They ran away like little puppies
It seems that although thermodynamics apply to some scientific concepts, they apply here as well. When everything is equal in one respect it is at its highest entropy (disorder). With mainland European politics the vast majoirity lies within the left-wing of politics. For people to order themselves, they need to separate into camps with people of common beliefs. In mainland Europe, most people think alike economically and alike with respect to authority. For Europeans to separate themselves, then, they need to consider more "trivial" divisions in the political spectrum. For example, there is only a fraction of a difference between the European Green party and the European Liberal Democrats. One is more environmentally-oriented than the other. Otherwise, they both support welfare, taxing the rich, healthcare for everyone and pension programs for the elderly. @Glas, I read that the Labour party is currently "imitating" the low-tax policies of the conservatives so that the people will have more faith in the Labour party. The conservatives say that the Labour party has enacted "indirect taxes" to fulfill their agenda, yet still remain in the confidence of the UK citizens. Is this a fair analysis (it comes from a UK partisan source)? What this thread really needs to reach is this conclusion: Do you agree that tbe center of European politics is to the left of the center of the United States's politics? We never really had established this before we moved on to other topics.
I thought we got that conclusion in the last thread? Maybe Zembla et al would be happier if you substitute with "the weighted center" so that you dont exclude the existence of all kinds of extremists in europe - they are just not as prominent as (the right) extremists in US. Sorry mate, here is where we clash! "Hier stehe ich, ich kann nicht anders!" - The trick is Die Welt kannt anders and you wont even notice when someone pulled the carpet.
Ok Squirl, it's simple you don't understand UK political parties, your brief would read like this: Q. Should the government heavily regulate industry with regard to pollution? UK Parties Conservatives: Can we get away with it again? Answer probably not. Labour: What can we do to re-Nationalise the stuff the Tories sold, not much and it'll cost a fortune so we won't. Liberals: Definite YES Socialists: What was the question again? UK Nationalists: Whatever the opposite is to what Brussels wants to do. Greens: We should abolish industry and all go back to our roots Scottish Nationalists: Has bugger all to do with them because they can make there own decision these days. As shown above UK & European politics are alot different to US. Why because we simply don't trust politicians. Believe it or not UK, Germany, France, Belguim etc even though it may not seem like it but we take Politics very seriously and a huge amount of debate goes on. Our history goes back 2000 years here, thats alot of wars and alot of growing up thats gone on in Europe. Sadly Thatcherism was part of that Growing up and will not happen again within our lifetimes. Mal
I think it's better to have a diversity of parties than just two. As you've shown and the test theres lots of different policies and things that need considering in our lives and just having two parties, one yes, one no across the board is not enough. All the UK parites (thats about 30 I think) have different views on each item, the trick is to find the one where you and they have the most things you agree on because you are never going to agree with every policy a Party has but theres still other parties you can vote for if theres only one thing you disagree on that will share similar views. Thats why the Liberal Democrats have a hard time, they have to try and catch the people between Labour and Tory, sadly for them this bunch is made up of people who support the less known parties UKIP, BNP, Green, Teddy Bears Picnic party, Monster Raving looney Party etc Mal P.S. my scores: Economic Left/Right: -4.63 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.87 Partial list of UK Political parties: http://www.ukelect.co.uk/Links.htm#UKPoliticalParties
About the Euro, In 1970ish (Can't remember the exact date, was a baby UK went Decimal money, this meant everyone had to relearn how money worked. That means everyone in the UK aged 40+ remembers this and how bloody difficult it was (heck they still give the weather in Fahrenheit because half the population still don't understand Centigrade). Thats one of the main reasons we're none to keen on the Euro. Mal
Yes, Malino, I'm aware of that Although here we call it humor: Americans are so practical, we dispensed with the extra vowel
You want me to kill you? I fucking hate religion, and specially catholic religion. You better not try to guess anything ever again
WTF, broz... You usually do, with that 37mm you tote around So, my next guess is that it was lucky I logged off MA earlier today
It did, but in what sense? In being catholic? Or being anti-religious? I think your question is quite absurd (no offence), as we are all brought up regarding our elders, and we do what we learn from them, so iguess i'm quite similar to "spanish people", as you must be to "czech people" (though, of course, every person's a world). So, what's the sense of your question? Because maybe i don't get the point...
i just wanted to say that spanish culture is quite soaked with catholicism. it's a generall stuff, not really just particular things connected with religion or whatsoever i mean... spanish ppl are very catholic in way they .... cook their meals ie if it does sound absurd to you you prolly understand it quite well i see you can hate just the particular things so don't let yourself be distracted by my writing
I don't think it is so much a case of Labour 'imitating' the tax policies of the Tories. They have definitely raised the amount of indirect taxes (although the largest indirect tax, VAT, remains unchanged). However, I think such a statement does not give enough credit to the Chancellor, Gordon Brown, who has managed the UK economy very effectively in Labour's time in power. This has not been done on the back of the addition of a few extra indirect taxes that are paid once in a blue moon, or not at all by some people (taxes like Inheritance Tax, Capital Gains tax, etc). Under Labour, Social spending has not increased a great deal, neither has spending on any public services to be honest, save for perhaps education. Basically, I think that Labour has simply been very prudent in all of its economical decision making which has resulted in a very vibrant economy and low unemployment. It is extremely difficult for the Tories to come up with a manifesto that will challenge Labour, because it all involves lower taxes. People remember the sacrifices this country had to make in order for the Tories to reach their goal of lower taxation last time, and very few people want a return to those times imo. People here can see past the political rhetoric that emanates around election time. More and more people realise that a better economical situation gives the country more stability, stronger growth, lower unemployment etc. For this reason, I can see Labour staying in power for as long as Gordon Brown is part of the Cabinet. He is probably the most successful Chancellor in this country's history. And even the Tories would have trouble disputing this. But anyway, no I dont think Labour is 'imitating' the Tories on taxes. I think Labour (and Gordon Brown in particular) is simply following the grand plan they have to (a) restore the country's economical fortunes (which they have now succeeded in doing; and (b) to ensure the economy stays stable, thereby increasing economic growth, lowering unemployment, etc whilst keeping ALL spending at realistic levels. Basically, prudence is the order of the day as far as Labour is concerned, and it could be said that it is from here that there current success stems. Hope that ramble made some sense
OK However, you should see our society nowadays. We've changed a lot from the typical spanish image of the Virgin in every car, and the portrait of Jesus in the top of the bed. We've become a society quite tired of all that idiosincrasy (is that the word? ), and most of young people are against anything related to catholicism (action-reaction against our parents, i guess). But anyway, yes, there's still that aura of mysticism in our habitudes, and i guess it will take time for us to get rid of it. As a simple comment, spanish catholic church is desperated, because almost nobody wants to join them as preachers, and they've suffered the loss of a lot of believers in last years. I wouldn't be amazed if the next Pope would be spanish, just to promote catholic church in Spain....
