Hi everyone, of all Spitfire marks, the Mk V was the one built in the greatest numbers. Not all Mk V aircraft were the same, though - late Mk V aircraft were considerably improved over the early Mk V aircraft, much like the Me 109F-4 was improved over the Me 109F-2. Here's my proposal: - Make two different Spitfire V models instead of one. Create a Spitfire Vb: - slow speed of an early Mk Vb (roughly as current Spitfire V) - negative G cut-out - 60 rounds per cannon Create a Spitfire Vc: - high speed of late Mk Vc (higher than current Spitfire V) - no negative G cut-out - 120 rounds per cannon Introduction: - Spitfire Vb: April 1941 (as before) - Spitfire Vc: July 1942 (at the same time as Fw 190A-4) The Spitfire Vc with much more power than the Spitfire Vb will be able to hold its energy much better than the Vb and be a better opponent for the contemporary Gold fighters, including the Fw 190A-4. Additional proposal: Make the Seafire II an L.IIc with: - higher speed at low altitude (higher than current Spitfire V) - lower speed at medium and high altitude - no negative G cut-out - 120 rounds per cannon That will make the Seafire II a better Jabo and low-altitude fighter and a markedly different aircraft from the land-based Spitfires. It can also double as LF.V in scenarios. The L.IIc was the standard Seafire anyway. Regards, Henning (HoHun)
The Spitfire V, entered service in february of 1941, this was powered by a 1,440-hp Merlin 45 series engine, and was the first model to be fitted with tropical equipment, and the first to be used as a fighter-bomber, with one 500 or two-250 lb (227- or 133-kg) bombs. Production of the Spitfire V totalled 6,479 aircraft, in three major versions: The VA, with eight machine guns, the VB with two cannons and four machine guns, and the VC with the universal wings, capable of accepting either A or B armament or four cannons. With the decline of axis air strength, the Spitfire V was used increasingly for low level attacks. In this capacity it was fitted with merlin 45M, 50M, or 55M engines and clipped wings of 32 feet 2 inches (9.80 m). I vote for the Spitfire VC with clipped wings. and for the Seafire IIC. just please have correct speeds. oh i also think you should post who voted. (no offense, i think true golds would vote for it to be unrealistic in a bad sense) just my opinion, but a valid concern. nice post
No offence, but: <shut up, will you?> Can't you cut out your color racism for a second? Aside from that. It would be great to have, Spit. Vb, Spit. Vc and Seafire L. IIc If you are interested what the performance will be like, then you should go here --> http://www.fourthfightergroup.com/eagles/spittest.html
well, me voted for maximal realism question : would those L models of spit/seafires have cutted wings and improved roll rate?
Spit F.Mk Vc Spit F.Mk Vb Spit LF.MkV Spit LF.MkIX or LF.MkXVI (one of those would be very useful in arena)
Hi Manoce, >question : would those L models of spit/seafires have cutted wings and improved roll rate? As that would require a change of the 3D model, probably not. The "L" designation orginally meant the engine type, by the way, and the wings could be clipped or not regardless of the designation. (I believe there were more un-clipped "L" Spitfires than clipped ones, anyway.) Clipping would also have drawbacks, such as higher stall speed, increased turn radius, slower sustained turn rate and increased energy bleed. Regards, Henning (HoHun)
i know about drawbacks of clipped wing spits so my question should be : "are there gonna be changes in FM of L spits because of their clipped wings - like roll rate, turn radius, stall speed etc. ?" (even w/o changing "normal wings" 3D model? - i see that changing 3D model is neccassary for cutting wings but it isn't neccessary for changing these parameters, right?) thx for info, btw
Hi Manoce, >"are there gonna be changes in FM of L spits because of their clipped wings - like roll rate, turn radius, stall speed etc. ?" (even w/o changing "normal wings" 3D model? It's not up to me to make the decision, but I wouldn't suggest to have a flight model that is in contradiction to the visual model. (Stuff like using the Typhoon for the Tempest or a Ki-43 for a Ki-44 would be OK though. The reward would be greater there.) Regards, Henning (HoHun)
introducing spitV with clipped wings would drastically change style of 1 on 1 close fighting vs bf 109F -- i think this would be interesting -- but i see that with the same 3D model it would be very confusing for gold pilots (is it L version behind me or not - should I do plain sccissors or not.. - mb this should be solved by different icon) btw if ki 44 would be introduced, imho ki 84 3D model is more similar to the looks of ki 44
lol color racism. sorry but golds suck! except for a certain few. and those certain few havn't posted in this thread yet. lol shut up, good one. i already asked to be taken off from posting here at FH forum. but it looks as if i still have a voice to sounds my opinion. like it or not! so sorry urines!
Hi Manoce, >introducing spitV with clipped wings would drastically change style of 1 on 1 close fighting vs bf 109F In fact, introducing the Spitfire V with +12 lbs boost will drastically change style of fighting vs. Me 109F already - you noticed the new Spitfire would be slightly faster below 4 km? >mb this should be solved by different icon) That would be a possiblity, but it would single out the Spitfire Vc from all the other Spitfires that are just "Spit". But as +12 lbs was used with full-span aircraft, too, it won't be necessary to "fake" a Spitfire by providing a "Clip" icon This is really a question of the quality of the illusion, if you know what I mean. >btw if ki 44 would be introduced, imho ki 84 3D model is more similar to the looks of ki 44 It was just an example, but you may be right - I actually read a combat report of P-47 pilots who claimed a "Ki-44" when they had shot down a Ki-84 in reality. Regards, Henning (HoHun)
Hi Beryl, >Gimme Ki-44 with 37mm guns (or 40mm..can't remember) LOL! They were extremely low velocity, the MK108 would look like a laser cannon in comparison! Regards, Henning (HoHun)
bizerk you are right! Golds really suck. They arent only half as good as reds in vulching, chutekilling etc...
Hi HoHun, as always you wrote up a great proposal, I'd only like to throw in my 2c: If anything of this goes thru, plz try to make it as realistic as possible, ie. if FH has no time to adjust 3D model for clipped spit, then don't make it a clipped version, just make realistic engine changes and FM changes for uprated unclipped v. IMHO it is very important to see in a fight a proper 3D model of a plane in your 6 or 12. I also URGE FH to stop with new planes and catch their breath, thus first perfecting what we have. This includes 3D models, cockpits, FMs, etc. When everything is squared out then think about new planes. Also, external bombs on 3D models should be corrected, (for ex. on spit xvi 1 250lb is visible along with 1 500lbs on centerline, can this be corrected?). When can we expect F4U1a and Tempest 3D models? Again: FH plz don't do make-shift solutions, better to wait a while and do it properly then to have a zillion open questions, bitching on the forum, and no time for repairs. Also, IMHO, a list of all current and planned projects should be available on site, and FH shouldn't deviate from this. This should lessen the number of "can we have this" messages on the forum, and thus constant annoyance to developers It would also help to make a list of help approved by FH: xxx is making cockpit for Me410, xxx is making skin for P51, etc. So anything not currently in works can be picked up by someone who wants to help.
