Fair Chances when Outnumbered?

As moderators/beta testers, their views hold more sway with admins. Therefore I felt that, regardless of what anyone else's view was on the streak restriction, they would still propose it to admins.

This, however, only became clear after about 25 pages of the thread.

I agree he does, and I admire him for that. But I dont agree that he should go to the extent of changing people's words to suit his own argument, or to make people look silly (which he has done on more than one occasion).

-glas-

 

this is the problem with the 2nd person, singular or plural, well with English the most because the plural and the singular are exactly the same, but the problem is it's very hard to find out who's meant with the you sometimes...

in this case I should've perhaps said malino, but as you are continuing the discussion I guess I aimed it at you...

well, when you say he's a control freak, I can't figure any positive feelings towards him suggesting things... especially not when it's said like this: "Nic, he's a control freak because he insists his new "rules" are the only solution to a problem, and no-one can possibly have a solution that is better or equals his own"

ho-hun never said that he would only accept his own idea, by sayig such a thing it is implied he want him to shut up, I can't really imagine one would say such a thing and still not bother him suggesting things he sees as improvements... no, it clearly implies that it's no longer wanted that he gives suggestions because he is so called incapable of arguing because he likes to adapt to your words and then play into that, he likes to win an argument, well well, how odd... we all want to...

when I argue with him I don't feel like that, I feel he's trying to adapt to my words, and reflect his own views upon that, and then try to give it another daylight... I don't know how you feel about such things though...

<Z>

 

I havent said anywhere that he is a control freak mate. I simply pointed out to nic (on the last page) that I felt Hohun and odi had no intention of making the 'streak restriction' thread a discussion, as if it was open to debate (which was my impression from the first 20 or so pages).

I found out later, from several statements that both Hohun and odi made, that they were already decided to go to admins to have this idea implemented, and it wasnt a case of 'if', but 'when'.

I dont have, and never have had a problem with Hohun. I simply resent the way that a) the thread was presented, and b) what I felt was a condescending attitude to those who posted ideas which didnt agree with the one suggested.

It is one thing to be steadfast in your opinions, but to be so at the expense of trying to make others look as if they are stupid is plain wrong.

-glas-

 

I haven't actively participated in the thread so I cannot know...

reason: too much offtopic and not enough serious arguments... (ain't flaming/blaming anyone here)

sooooo, you might be right, but at least we got some things straight

<Z>

 

Zem, at the beginning of this thread I posted that in my opinion there where more importants matters that needed resolving before we went ahead with hohuns proposal, and that fixing the outstanding problems would also have an effect on game balance so huhuns argument at this stage was shortsighted.


Out of a 30 line post hohun took 3 lines and avoided the point entirely.

That is what annoyed me.


Malino

 

if he cropped a tiny piece of your post and you feel it affected the discussion, just ask him to not do it again
he was doing that in my past discussion with him on the icons topic, and i asked him to not remove portions of my posts. he was kind enough to never do it again in that thread right away!

and even if you're annoyed, it doesnt mean you can go calling him a control freak. hold your horses, go for your usual smoke and then post. this is a moderatorial warning, as that was taken as an insult.

 

Nic, I originally tried to point out that other factors effected game balance, one example being Buffs. I took an He177 up from F16 and after an hour had climbed to 4K alt only to die shortly after when a P51 spotted my huge black fat dot from D150 and came and blew me to pieces (still in gold territory). If I'd taken a B24J for example in an hour I could have been at 8-10K alt and totally invisible to any gold unless theywere lucky enough to have someone guiding them on radar.

Issues like this have a huge impact on field capture, which then have an impact on hohuns suggestion for balance.

My thoughts and those of several others who also raised seperate issues which effect Hohuns proposal were taken piecemeal, out of context, and twisted to remove credibility with basically an insistence that the original proposed "rule" is the only solution.

Yes there may come a time when an open informative discussion on players balance becomes neccessary but there are to many other issues that should be addressed first (IMHO). And at this time the problem of players balance is not as extreme as it's being made out to be (look at the players count http://scores.wbfree.net/cgi-bin/pcount.cgi ) Also as my colleagues have already pointed numerical advantage dosn't have that big an impact on field captures, Squad actions and Discipline account for more field captures than numerical advantage.

Another thing to remember is that FHWB is a multi-role game, ok one side may have 40 players and the other 20 but what are those 40 players doing? Are they all Jabo? some will be sitting in the tower (getting pissed and smoking pot) some will be up in buffs climbing, some on field defense, some as jabo's and some "quaking" (hell maybe even some fishing off the deck of the CV). Last night the arena numbers were balanced, yet at F31 it was 15 golds fighting (vulching) about 5 reds, are we soon to be looking at a proposed rule that balances the number of players over fields?

Malino

 

that's a post on the thread's topic, 100% fine!
i'm not complaining about your point of view on the issue, neither am i complaining that you think ho-hun may be twisting facts. the problem is that you went and called him a control freak. insults and abuses aren't allowed in the forum.

now questioning a person's way of discussion, or showing your point of view on a matter is perfectly fine, as long as you dont abuse.

nic

 

Mal does make a very good point tho. The biggest problems in the Arena at the moment seem to be the damage model for some (or maybe even all) planes.

I dont count any hits above D3 as 'hits' to a con when deciding whether he should have been downed or not. Yet regularly, I see me plying a con with 10-15x20 and 20-30x12mm (in 109-G6) and he flies on as if nothing has happened, continuing the usual outrageous warproll maneuvres that are so commonplace in the arena.

I think Malino's original point that this should be addressed before we start discussing things like 'arena balance' etc is very valid. There are some planes in the Arena that are akin to flying tanks (110 (except for pilot armour), P39, IL2) whereas some are liking flying bits of cardboard (regular 1x20mm killing cfuel in 190).

Changes to make the game better, fairer, etc are all good. But only if the basics of the game are functioning correctly imo.

-glas-

 

Explain your reasoning.




Mal

 

guys, itson both sides for the damage model, i often fly off with many rounds in me, but i like to think that most are all over the aircraft and not in one spot. but on the other hand, i have died alot from a single bullet, and a single hit to a criticle area, i don't like it, but hey these are the chances we take. lets be glad this isn't the real thing. the thought of any rounds coming at me in real life, is a scarey thing. nowabout game balance, it shifts back and forth, just go back and look throught the years. golds had it, then reds had it then gold (for what seemed like an eternity) then red(now) again. i came on last night and reds were outnumbered 2 to 1 odds, but in the span of about an hour, golds numbers had reduced, and it was the other way around. i see no need for any kind of balance control. it just seems like another restriction to fun, but i suppose right after this poll/survey goes away, another will pop up, probably by the same person, yet again.

<s>

bullet

 

does control freak mean anything?

 

I sense the influence of the dark side badly on this one [/yoda]

sjeesj biz, then you come up with a proposition eh, it's not fair to shoot at any decent proposal without coming up with a counter proposal...



<Z>

 

Sorry zemb bud, but i do not think a counter proposal is necessary. because i do not think the current way things are in the arena are wrong. but the point i wanted to stress was that if it's not plane restrictions, it's helping the side that is out numbered. so basically the same arguement just worded differently. it is getting like a broken record. these things have been put to vote alot. and most are not disatisfied with the current way planes come out. (my only gripe is thier is no set RPS to gauge when a particular favorite ride comes out. but i think the reason thier is no RPS is because some pilots just wouldn't fly or enter the arena unless thier particular favorite ride came out. so it is best to not post when a particular ride comes out. just my opinion) it is almost like asking your dad for a new bicycle, and he says NO. then you go to your mom and ask her to see if you can get a different answer. please don't take this way out of context zembla or hohun. i like you both, but this or these similar topics are a dead horse. again just my opinion

<s>

bull

 

This is a participant warning, as that was taken as an insult.





Malino

 

This has got to be one of the absurdest ideas I've seen on here ever. I am not going to fly for gold. Period!

(Okay, until I get my internet back I'm not going to fly for __anyone__, but you get the point ...)

 

Use the score multiplier that acts accordingly to how far outnumbered a side is.


If there are only 3 red pilots and 21 golds, then the outnumbered get a multiplier higher than if there are 10 red and 21 golds.

It doesn't seem to matter which color because I see the same pilots always on the side with the highest numbers.

 

cc, now multiplier work wit hcurent ratio of pilot on each side.

btw, this is almost 3 years old topic